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tv   Charlie Rose  PBS  March 8, 2012 12:00am-1:00am PST

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>> rose: welcome to our program. we begin evening with a look at russia and newly elected president vladimir putin. masha guess season the author of "the man without a face: the unlikely rise of vladimir putin." >> we're seeing 12 years of destruction of public space, political institutions and the media. so we have no politics. and as a result we have no politicians. you can't have political debate without having public conversation, without political debate you can't have politicians. so the first thing we're going to have to do is build institutions. and that's the remarkable thing about this protest movement. we have a street movement for institutions. that's what this movement wants. >> rose: we continue this evening looking at peyton manning, one of the great quarter backs in the n.f.l. who announced he will not be at
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indianapolis anymore. we're joined by peter king, senior writer for "sports illustrated" and a contributor for nbc's "football night in america." >> here's one thing about manning that we saw today. we saw how vitale important football is to him. >> rose: yes. >> and i will never forget doing a very long interview with him three years ago when he discussed how he overcame a staph infection in his knee to play and about three weeks before the season started a friend of his was in doing rehab with him and he looked down and he thought the knee looked like a human brain. that's how bad... in such bad condition it was. because of the staph infection. but the thought of missing a game was so distasteful and so almost reprehensible to him that he played probably before he should have played but if he didn't play it would have
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bothered him for the rest of his life. >> rose: we conclude this evening with tina brown, editor-in-chief of the daily beast and "newsweek" magazine talking about her annual summit "women in the world." >> i have met some amazing women who had such vivid stories to tell, they've been through such incredible things and i thought these people never get heard, let's put them on the stage because it's very hard for them to get media attention because people are not so interested in foreign affairs. >> rose: russia and vladimir putin, peyton manning and women in the world, the annual summit put together by tina brown when we continue.
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captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york
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city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: vladimir putin won his third six-year term as president of russia on march 4. an opposition movement that challenges his legitimacy is disputing the widely anticipated outcome. putin has dominated russian politics for more than a decade. in 2008 he moved to the post of prime minister but continued to be russia's most influential politician. he announced he'd return to the presidency last september. he has astounding popularity that's started to wayne. his party, united russia, attained a faint majority in december's contested parliamentary elections. since then, a series of unprecedented anti-government protests have followed. joining me now masha gessen, a russian author and a squrnlist. her new biography of putin tracings his political aseptember. it's called "the man without a face: the unlikely rise of vladimir putin." i'm pleased to have her here at this table for the first time.
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welcome. >> thank you. it's great to be here. >> rose: how is it to be a journalist in russia today? >> it's dangerous. the various organizations like the committee to protect journalist name it as one of the most dangerous countries for journalists to work. >> rose: so it continues. >> it continues. and it's more than being dangerous, it's frustrating. there's no freedom of information act to work with. access to public records is probably as restricted as it has ever been since the fall of the soviet union. the whole political machine is basically closed. >> rose: even historians tell me they previously had access to k.g.b. records and they shut it down. no more. >> that's right. >> rose: so it's almost like we want to hide our history. >> it's not almost like. >> rose: it is. >> it is we want to hide our history. >> rose: have you felt the same fear others have felt and seen colleagues that you know intimidated and in some cases... >> yes, i live in moscow.
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some of my friends have been threatened, some of my friends have been beaten up and some of my friends have been killed. i have been threatened myself. i'm very lucky and i don't want to overexaggerate how much threat there is because people i know personally have actually ended up in intensive care in the last couple years. nothing like that has happened to me so i feel very lucky. >> rose: the latest copy of the "economist" magazine you see in the cover. so where do you think he is today in the face of this election, accusations of fraud people in the streets giving some voice to discontent with him and his policies. >> he... you know, we saw he cried on monday... on sunday night actually. >> rose: genuine or for show? >> i think it's genuine. i mean, if the man were capable of crying for show he might have cried after the coasting
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submarine sank. he thinks it's over. he thinks that now that he's declared he's won the election it's over and the protests will have to stop. so we saw more police interference on monday than in months previous. i think the police may use force and putin has set up that it should end. it's not going to end and his legitimacy is shot and this is something he doesn't realize. >> rose: what does that suggest might be the political conflict over the next several years and the conflict in the streets of moscow and st. petersburg. >> frankly, hoping that the protest movement doesn't get intimidated and doesn't fizzle i think it's not going to take a
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few years, i think it's a matter of months, maybe a year or two. >> rose: we will see some confrontation that will change russia >>. >> i think we will, yes. the thing to understand about the protests is that putin is not their intended audience. it's not like we expect him to look out the kremlin window, see hundreds of thousands of people out there and say "okay, i'm going to resign. he's planning to hold on to power forever. but the audience of the protest movement is the lowest rung of the period on which the structure sits and that's coming apart. there's a lot of evidence coming apart. and once it starts coming apart the whole edifice will collapse. >> rose: let me understand you. the protest movement is directed to them and saying we want you to hear. is we want you to change. >> we want you to join us. we want you to stop engaging in corrupt practices. and that is happening. it's interesting as the dust is settling on the election we've seen two completely contradictory things. on the one hand, we're seeing
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unprecedented violations. all these supplementary voter rolls, several million votes cast by unidentifiable people. on the other hand we're seeing an unprecedented number of precincts where there are no violations and i think that's where we're seeing people who have heard the protest movement and who've decided that they now want to play by the rules. that's just one thing. another thing is the police. there's some evidence... not a lot, but there's some evidence that the police at least in moscow and st. petersburg are quite sympathetic towards the protest movement which is why the kremlin has felt compelled to bring in interior ministry troops to break up the demonstration on monday. >> rose: tell me what you think might happen. if something's going to happen in the next six months, give me range of things that could happen. best-case scenario from my point of view, the protest movement continues, there's a large-scale protest, putin orders the use of
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force, decisive use of force, not like has been done in the last couple days and the interior troops do not obey the order. at this point he feels that he has no more recourse. he has to negotiate for an exit, he has to negotiate for immunity from prosecution. that's when we get a transitional government that would be technocratic for a year or two to rebuild the institutions that have been destroyed under putin and hold new elections. that's the best-case scenario. worst? the protest movement fizzles. another worst-case scenario he orders the use of force, force is used and the protest movement goes underground. >> rose: what's the most likely scenario? >> actually, i think the first scenario. >> rose: the first is most likely? >> i think so. >> rose: he basically negotiates for his own impunity from prosecution. >> right. he's not going to negotiate unless he feels that he has no recourse but when he does he's going to have ask for immunity.
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>> rose: what is his relationship to the oligarchs? >> the oligarchs is a murky term. >> rose: it is. as soon as i said that i realized it. >> i think we have proper oligarchs. there was an identifiable group of men in the late '90s who really did have a hand in running the country and who had a lot of the country's wealth. >> rose: and they had wealth because they controlled natural resources previously owned by the state. >> right. a lot of that wealth has been redistributed under putin. >> rose: to his friends. >> to his friends, exactly. so we don't know how a lot about the people who control it now. i mean, they're men without faces as well. >> rose: how much money has vladimir putin because of this set aside. because you hear these phenomenal suggestions. >> there's very little information about his personal wealth. it seems to be vast. at one point there was this
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figure of $40 billion bandied around. it could have been any other figure. we don't know there are things like... the putin palace in the black sea which i describe in the book in some detail. that's a thing that... a plaything that cost about a billion dollars to product and the construction wasn't completed. so we're talking about very large amounts of money he has accumulated. >> rose: and does that give him what power? >> that's an interesting question because even though money and power in russia, of course, is intertwined and power is in large part a way of getting 2 t money and getting to control the country's natural resources, what does he really get out of things like the black sea palace in? that's hard to say that. 's kind of a pointless thing for the russian president to build with his so-called personal funds. he's not going to use it while
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he's president and he's not going to use it after he's president because it's not in venezuela or some other place where he's likely to live after he is president. so the point of that accumulation of wealth is difficult to pinpoint. >> rose: you believe his days are numbered. >> i do. >> rose: so what's the future of russia without vladimir putin? >> that's a difficult question. we... what we're seeing are the consequences of 12 years of destruction of public space, political institutions and the media. so we have no politics. and as a result we have no politicians. you can't have political debate without having public conversation, without political debate you can't have politicians. so the first thing we're going to have do is build institutions that's the remarkable thing about the protest movement. we have a street movement for institutions. that's what this movement wants. >> rose: civic institutions. >> exactly. >> rose: a rule of law.
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>> that's right. that's right. so when we get institutions that's when we have political institutions. and at first it will be rudimentary because not a lot of things grow in the political cultural vacuum. there's nationalism, that's expected and always appears there where there's vacuum. there's libertarianism, another fairly primitive political ideology that can grow in the absence of any nuance. and then we're going to have to negotiate nuanced positions. >> rose: let's talk about how he got to be who he is. we know he was a k.g.b. agent, we knew he grew up in st. petersburg and where he got his political start as well. >> right. >> rose: and we also know he was in a sense, chosen by boris yell seine? that's correct. it happened in the late '90s. boris yeltsin was at very low point in his political popularity. the country felt ashamed of him.
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some people who were close to him felt heartbroken. he was an embarrassment. >> rose: he became an embarrassment. he started as a hero and became an embarrassment. >> that's right. he was ill, he has a drinking problem and he alienated most of the people close to him over the years so he found himself in complete isolation and in extreme fear that when somebody new came to power-- which had to happen-- he would be prosecuted. so he and his inner circle-- which by that point was tiny-- were casting about for somebody who could be appointed prime minister and anointed his successor. and they didn't have a lot of people to pick from. one of the people they found was putin. other people they considered also seemed to be these faceless bureaucrats. and i think we got unlucky that they picked putin and not the transportation minister. >> rose: there's no political class capable of leading now? or not. >> there's no political class because there has been no
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politics. we have to create one. >> rose: that takes a while, doesn't it? >> it takes a while. things happen faster than they used to but we need a year. >> rose: does putin have an argument that goes like this: leave government to me, i'll take care of you. the economy is better we still played a big role in the world. just trust me and don't bother me >> you're understating his argument a little bit. >> i'm sure. what is it? >> he's saying if not i things will collapse. >> rose: that's always a dictator's argument. >> right. i'm the only one who can hold it together and make the great country governable. it will fall apart literally if i go. we're surrounded by enemies i'm the only one who can hold down the fort. that's every dictator's argument. every dictator creates a siege
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mentality. >> rose: and certain people say yes, he's right. >> there are certain people who say yes he's right. but if you look at the numbers closely on sunday there are two independent exit polls, one places putin's numbers around 45%, the other around 50%. righting? so we're seeing that he got somewhere around half the vote in a situation where the campaign was rigged, where none of his opponents who were hand picked campaigned vigorously at all. where we had almost exclusive access to the media. where his message of fear went unchallenged and even in that situation he probably can't get a majority. >> rose: so suppose the election were fair what would be the consequences? >> this particular election could not have been fair because in the first place the only people allowed on the ballot were the people putin wanted on the ballot. you can't get on the ballot otherwise. so we have to rebuild the political institutions of russia to even get a fair election.
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but putin's party would get a minority of seats. >> rose: aband what about medvedev? >> what about medvedev? he played a good first lady to putin for four years. his role was largely ceremonial, he reached out to the disenfranchised who included the liberal intelligentsia. >> rose: did he even think for a moment of challenging pew anyone is >> certainly doesn't seem that way. >> rose: it doesn't. he might have back then, i don't know. >> for four years he had the legal right to fire putin. and he didn't do it. >> rose: could he have pulled it off? >> we don't know, he never tried. >> rose: what is it we don't know about putin that you want us to know? >> i think there are two things that are important to understand about him. one is that he governs by instinct, not strategy.
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and that's to create a system as close to the kk as a country can be. that's the best institution he can imagine. >> rose: what would that be like? >> closed, paranoid, fearful, information doesn't come in. that's very much... >> rose: and rule by force? >> and rule by force and corrupt he's largely succeeded in doing that. he doesn't have a long-range plan. everything he is doing is something that he thought of this morning and is carrying out. and everything is geared toward holding on the power. the longer it goes, the more desperate he is to hold on to power because he realizes he, too, will face prosecution as soon as he loses power. so that's one thing important to understand about him. the other thing that's important is that i think has been... has not been understood before is that he's very consistent. he's never waivered.
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i believe he was on the side of the hard-liners in the 1991 coup. he's always been on the side of the k.g.b.. >> rose: this is the coup in which they went after gorbachev? >> right, this was the coupe that was organized by the head of the k.g.b.. >> rose: who went to prison for that. >> who went to prison for that and was president at the first inauguration. >> rose: so you think putin was part of the coupe? >> i think putin was on the side of the cue coup and there's some evidence... if we getting access to records properly there will be overwhelming evidence he was an active participant. >> rose: active? >> yes. so he's always been on that side. and the whole idea that was so popular in the early 2000s that he's an economic reformer, a new kind of democrat, this was always all people's imagination. he never said anything of the sort. he's always been a k.g.b. man. and that in turn means nothing
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is going to change now. there's talk now of a putin 2.0, more liberal putin. that's not going to happen. the man has never changed his positions. he's not going to do it now. >> rose: how sad does it make when you think what russia could have been when the soviet union collapsed? >> it breaks my heart. >> rose: it does. a great place. >> when i was writing the part of the book that describes the late '80s and the very heady evolution speeding up as the soviet union was breaking apart and it seemed like the potential was endless and for a while it was the most exciting place in the world. i was reporting for american public kaycations and it seemed like this was the place where important conversations were happening. this was the place where people in the streets were debating the proper relationship between the individual and the states it was
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going to be a great country. it could have been. maybe it will be. >> so fair enough. what made it not happen? >> i would say two things made a big difference. one was an inability and a fear to deal with the history of the country. there was never a disorganization there was never grappling. the trial of the communist party fizzled. there was supposed to be a trial in a court of the communist party that got shut down. the organizers of the failed 1991 coup were never properly tried. the understanding at the time was that going forward with those trials and filtering out people who had actively worked for the regime would result in a witch-hunt and that peace was more important and that was a huge mistake. and one way in which it's a mistake, we never would have gotten a putin if k.g.b.
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officers were banned from serving in government jobs, for example. so that's one thing. and the other thing is that the democrats who... as they carried out early economic reforms, very necessary economic reforms probably could have done better but those reforms were carried out and there were by and large successful. they did not campaign for those reforms. they perceived them as technocrats, they did what they felt needed to be done and they did not feel that it was necessary to talk to people about them, explain what was going on and engage the public in a conversation about it. and so millions of russians felt that they not only got poorer and not only did life get harder but that they were misled. and they were had, basically. >> rose: court kov ski.
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does he have dimensions of sack rav. >> i have a piece in the "vanity fair" that's just on court kov ski. he was a fervent communist then a fervent capitalist. and then he became an advocate. the turning point was the 1998 financial crisis he was a great advocate for transparency. i think he believes those things and is willing to go to incredible lengths to prove that he... he lives by his ideas. is khodorkovsky.
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he went to jail basically voluntarily. >> rose: meaning if he'd done what he could have stayed out of jail. >> he was warned to stay out of the country. he was in the states the summer before he was jailed. he went back despite warnings that he would be jailed. i think part of him didn't belief he would be jailed or that he would be jailed for so long. >> rose: he was strong enough to fight back. >> right. but part of him is also... he felt that his business partner had already been arrested and he felt like he couldn't abandon him. his other business partner was arguing for them to stay out of the country they took... you don't negotiate with bandits, you get out and try to get your friend out. that was not khodorkovsky's position. to him he holds to a code of honor that only he holds to but he felt he needed to go to jail. >> rose: will he die in prison? >> if putin stays in power he
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die in prison. >> rose: so you're optimistic, though? >> i am optimistic. everything he said, this book "man without a face" i assume that's because of the whole k.g.b. notion of house of mirrors and nobody knows anything. >> right. and putin is unique among modern politicians in having had no public record. no public history before becoming head of state. he got to write his own story. kind of a scary story. he read the autobiography of a street thug. all he wanted people to know about him was that he was aggressive, had trouble controlling his temper and was physically violent. all pretty accurate. >> rose: and hugely vain. >> and vengeful. >> rose: and vengeful. >> rose: the book is called "the man without a face: the unlikely rise of vladimir putin." masha gessen. >> rose: peyton manning, one of the great n.f.l. quarter backs is leaving indianapolis today.
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the indianapolis colts announced the release of manning. he played 14 seasons with his team. he brought built the colts into an n.f.l. power. despite an other injury-free career he has been plagued by four neck surgeries over the last 19 months. he addressed the media today in a very emotional press conference. >> i've been a colt for almost all of my adult life but i guess in life and in sports we all know that nothing lasts forever times change, circumstances change and that's the reality of playing in the n.f.l. it truly has been an honor to play in indianapolis indiana. i do love it here. i love the fans and i will always enjoy having played for such a great team. i will leave the colts with nothing but good thoughts and gratitude to jim, the organization, my teammates, the media, and especially the fans.
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>> rose: joining me now is peter king. so when you watch this... makes you want to cry, doesn't it? >> i got a little choked up watching it today. it was... what was so interesting about it is that peyton manning is not an emotional person. at least not in games, not... you know, he doesn't get choked up. he is... he prides himself on being in control of every situation, of every setting. if i'm told peyton's going to call you today and you got 30 minutes, i made sure to look down at my watch at the 25-minute mark. and if there were questions i absolutely had to get in, i got them in in the next five minutes because he was a real stickler about being punctual and all that. >> rose: he was going to stop it after 30 minutes? >> not necessarily. if he was enjoying it, he was
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going to keep going. which happened to me with him a few times. but it's funny. when i watch that clip, charlie, i had to give a eulogy once for a neighbor who died, a young woman, and it was tremendously emotional. there were probably 500 people in the church that day and i got one great piece of advice. "don't look at anybody. look over their heads." so it's like you're looking at him and if you saw in the that clip, peyton manning looked like... when he would look up he'd be looking up high. like everybody was wilt chamberlain sized. but that's the thing that really... it impressed me because i know peyton manning... and he's told friends within the last two weeks the thing that really bothers me is that i never wanted to play anywhere else. i wanted to stay here the rest of my life. but as he said, it doesn't always work out that way.
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>> rose: was there no way to avoid this conclusion? >> charlie, it would have turned out to be ugly because the indianapolis colts were going to draft a guy who might have been cloned from the same material as peyton manning. and that's andrew luck of stanford who's one of the most cerebral quarter backs in college football history. maybe the most cerebral quarterback. they're going to draft him and you don't draft somebody as a first draft to put him behind somebody for two or three years and that's how long peyton manning wants too continue to play. easily he's one of the top five quarter backs of all the time and one of the great pieces of fun that i have in this business is to try to rate where does sammy boff rank... who played in the '40s and once led the... >> rose: for the redskins. >> once led the n.f.l. in
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passing, in punting, and led the league in interceptions as a defensive back in one year. how do you compare him to peyton manning or joe montana. but what makes manning so different is that you've heard of the phrase "coach on the field." all coaches like to have quarterbacks or point guards in basketball or catchers in baseball. they like to have what they call coaches on the field. >> rose: mike shi chef ski tells me that all the time. >> he wants to have somebody he wants this on the court. but manning the reason why it was so... it worked so well with all the different coachs is because he would take the game plan during the week he would go
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to his receivers and say "here's what we're going to do tomorrow." and i talked to his receivers and they say invariably it works the way he told us. and charlie to explain to people who they say he's a controlling guy but when the colts were in the super bowl, something happen i'll never forget. the n.f.l. allows one reporter from the media to watch practice to make sure nobody gets hurt and they don't hide the injury after practice 45 minutes on friday, peyton manning, the security guys, ball boys, trainers couple of front office
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people they stood out on the field with 128 footballs and those were going to be the footballs that will be the game balls in the game. but peyton wants them just so he'd break them in just like breaking in a baseball glove and he stood there for 45 minutes supervising everybody and at the end they'd hand him a ball and he'd say "that one is okay. that one's good." he controlled it down to his hands in a key drive on the fourth quarter. he knew if i take care of that football and it feels good on friday that means i won't get a funky football on game day in the most important game of the year. >> rose: where is the best place for peyton maning? >> well, i don't think there's one place for better than anywhere else which is why the next couple of weeks could be so entertaining. i think there are six or seven good places for him to go but i
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think a couple of them. miami with owner steven ross who has not had a great early ownership of the dolphins, he's wanted a couple coaches and finished second in both of them to other teams. i think he will spend the most money and he'll bring in peyton manning's friend reggie wayne and overpay reggie rain. mike shanahan in washington will go hard after manning but i get a sense peyton doesn't want to play against eli. if you're in washington, you're playing against your brother twice a year every year because the redskins and the giants are in the same division. so i'm not sure he wants to do that. >> rose: does he want to play in the same town as his brothers? >> the jets are going to go hard after peyton manning. i don't think that really bothers him very much. i think it would be great for him to be in new york. for this reason, charlie.
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>> rose: me, too. >> not only because it would just be fun to see him but it would be fun to see him play tom brady twice a year. imagine those jets patriots games. i can imagine the guys over at the network buildings right now please, the jets, the jets. >> rose: how would eli feel about this? >> eli is the classic don't worry be happy kid. eli is the little brother who always looked up to peyton and he'd always look at peyton as like his guy but remember this, eli was more of a mama's boy growing up and he never had the same competitive... he's grown into this really competitive character now but when he was a kid if he lost a game it was... eh. the sun comes up tomorrow. and i just think that eli
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wherever peyton goes he will think seriously that if that's the best thing for peyton, i'm happy. >> rose: oh, it's the best thing. (laughs) >> i hope it is, too! >> rose: can you see him walking into a restaurant in new york and there's eli and peyton having dinner? >> or can you see him walking over to rockefeller center and doing "saturday night live" or something like that? >> rose: the two of them together! >> yeah. there's one thing about manning that we saw today. we saw how vitale important football is to him and i will never forget doing a very long interview with him three years ago when he discussed how he overcame a staph infection in his knee to play about three weeks before the season started a friend was doing rehab with him and he thought the knee looked like a human brain, that's how bad... such bad
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condition it was because of the staph infection. but the thought of missing a game was so distasteful and so almost reprehensible to him that he played probably before he should have played but if he didn't play it would have bothered him for the rest of his life and he went on to win the most valuable player in that season. and when i think of manning i think of the 2008 season playing a month before anybody in their right mind would have played and then he went on to win the m.v.p. >> rose: what happened to him physically? >> well, what happened to him is that he hurt his neck and then he aggravated the injury to his neck. he's had a total of, as you say, four neck procedures. in essence, charlie, he had very serious neck surgery last september 8 and when he had that surgery he had supposedly the best neck surgeon in the country
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who told him listen, in six months you ought to be feeling good enough so that you can play football again. and what's been difficult, though, that nobody can ever predict is how long it takes the nerve to regenerate from the neck and the nerve going down into his arm to make his arm work. that's what's been very slow coming back and that's why doing a contract for peyton manning now is going to be very difficult because if you do a contract, you're trusting that he's going to play. and if you give a lot of money to him and then he doesn't play because of a salary cap system in the n.f.l. you could be in trouble for the next year or two. so i think teams with the exception of miami, which i think would give him the lease of the stadium if he said he would come and play, i think teams are... >> rose: they're going to give him the lease to the stadium? >> i think everybody's going to be a little bit cautious about how they... everybody will
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pursue him aggressively but in terms of what they'll pay him that's where the great disconnect comes out. >> rose: you could see his love of indianapolis there that was a young man who loved the place that he was because that's where he came of age. >> rose: charlie, i'm in the process of calling two people in indianapolis who named their children peyton and also of a girl who was in peyton manning children's hospital a few years ago and he just walked in and spent 45 minutes with her. just... you know, nothing, no cameras, no anything. there was nobody else in there. he just sat there n there with her for 45 minutes. he really became a part of the community a lot of superstars don't do this. >> rose: there's also this this week, this bounty business. how serious is that? >> charlie, it's serious from this standpoint. roger goodell over the last 18 months, the commissioner of the n.f.l., has made it job one,
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other than getting a new collective bargaining agreement, made job one trying to lessen and ameliorate the violence and the huge hits in profootball. ratcheting up the fines way up there. so while the league office has been sending the message, hey, lighten up, guys. you have one rogue team that's been out there and at least in one instance having players attempt to injure according to the n.f.l.... >> rose: and be paid based on what they did. >> let's knock brett favre out of the game, here's $10,000 if you knock him out of the game. and the n.f.l., charlie, i wrote in supports illustrated this
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week, some evidence after brett favre went out of that game of a defensive player saying "pay me my money." so right now i think what we're looking at is more investigation. but i think the n.f.l. is going to draw a much harder line with this scandal than they did with bill belichick and the patriots four years ago from the videotaping scandal because they feel like this team is so at cross purposes with what the league is trying to do. >> rose: peter king, senior writer for "sports illustrated" and a contributor for nbc's "football night in america." thank you always. >> thank you, charlie. >> rose: tina brown is here, she is the editor-in-chief of the daily beast and "newsweek" magazine. for the third year in a row she's hosting women in the world summit in new york. the kfrnts brings together women from across the globe to talk about their stories and their challenges. i'm pleased to have tina brown back at this table. welcome. >> thank you, charlie. >> rose: tell me about... where
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did this begin and where is it now, this idea that you have nurtured? >> we launched it three years ago. really just a passion play in a sense of myself and my editors at "newsweek" and the daily beast as it was just then daily beast. and we wanted to bring together women who were inspiring and have incredible stories because during the course of my exchanges with vital voices which mentors emerging leaders i have met some of these amazing women who had such vivid stories to tell. and i thought these people never get heard. let's put them on the stage. because it's very hard for them to get media attention because people aren't so interested in foreign affairs. >> so you decided to have women from around the wold come in. tell stories of bravery... >> and challenges and triumphs because the women we bring in are survivors, they are women who've triumphed, who've come out of things. women like lima bowie from
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liberia who launched a peace movement in leash ya and drove out the tyrant charles taylor. she's magnificent and lights up a room. and people liking the doctor from somalia who's incredible. here's a woman with 90,000 refugees on her farm in somalia. she was captured by rebels, she faced them down. >> rose: and tell me about the young woman i'm going to talk to on stage tonight. >> this is a very, very brave young woman who's a refugee who wond up in burr ruin di and her entire family was slaughtered in congo, her sister, her mothers, brothers, everyone killed. she escaped with a brother to new york through the u.n. and now she's living in up state new york and she's become a terrific photographer, a star student and the things they've been through, these people, are just remarkable and you want to hear them tell your stories and they're inspiring to re-evaluate what our own lives are. i think a lot of women in particular will come to the
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summit. it's almost as if we need to feel this kind of reenergizing in a sense as women here because the feminism movement et cetera has becoming a... until recently a... it lost a lot of energy and when you hear what these women go through just because they're women, just because they're women, it really does make you... >> rose: is feminism what we call the movement today? is it the empowerment of women? what is it we are talking about today that is a m.i.t. separating movement. >> i think what is galvanizing at the moment is safeguarding the freedoms of women. safeguarding the gains they've made here over the last 30 years. let's safeguard those freedoms, not have them eroded and in countries like in the arab spring in i jipt it's about winning those rights for the first time and i think what is very tragic in the arab spring is that so many of these women are feeling they played a crucial part in the revolution
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in tahrir square but now are being excluded from the process. now they're being reduced in their role because of the islamic... the rise of the islamic parties which is taking away any freedoms they had gained, ironically enough, in the hosni mubarak area. >> rose: and we just saw at this table where you're sitting a young russian journalist who is extraordinary in terms of the courage they have to make the case for change in their country >> well, masha guess on who i think is brilliant, she will be at our summit. >> rose: this is the cover of "newsweek." 150 fearless women in the world. the rise of china's billionaire tiger women. >> rose: we put masha guessen in our gallery. she was talking about cord r.o.v. ski being in a penal column. this is what i think we keep re-evaluating in our stage on saturday. we have a young woman from burma who was jailed for 11 years simply for distributing
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pamphlets in sport of aung san suu kyi's party in burma. 181 years and as soon as she got out... >> rose: right back. >> right back. >> rose: and aung san suu kyi has asked her to run, ant she? >> she has asked her to run for office and i think one of the things she's concerned about is making sure this is not a cult movement around aung san suu kyi. we want to grow a system where other women can flourish, too, and the whole political process can live yonld one. >> the idea is to tell stories. >> the idead is to tell stories and in so doing illuminate the lives of people who live between the lines of the news. we see the headlines, we see these explosive events, afghanistan, what's going on in burma. we don't meet the women living behind the lines of the news. >> rose: the flesh and blood of the people carrying the torch. >> and women who have been left behind by war.
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for instance, when we get out of afghanistan we leave behind these women who are going to be facing again the threats of little bits of freedom being eroded. what happens to women left behind in war? >> and big issues having to do with rape and war as a tool of war. violence against women in a whole range of areas that are still there in different cultures practiced and carried out everyday. >> rose: absolutely. it's...... >> absolutely. it doesn't change. in somalia, the women fleeing the doctor's camp were raped as they fled. and it's unbelievable, really, what they go through since the... because they're women. >> rose: in the best of societies, how is the work force changing because of women? >> i think what we're seeing is... >> rose: and is it you have? >> well, i think there's a great moment to the quota system. in places like finland it's proved to be enormously effective.
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although there is peer pressure to have more women at the table in this country, it's a very small amount at the top because unless you legislate for it, people or if you've a company that's had men at the top, you going to hire people you know, that means you're hiring another man. >> rose: will that change with more women in power? >> i think it is changing, yes. i think hillary clinton has been an immense for for this in the state department largely because she has integrated women in into every bit of her outlook on policy. >> rose: and she's honored them wherever she goes. >> and she's in thed women into all the things she has done by working so closely with the ambassador for women and she has made a point every country she goes of meeting with delegations of women. when she goes to places like yemen she always makes the point even if they try to stop her doing so of having town halls of women. so those women when you talk to
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them it's meant so much secretary clinton spoke to us. >> rose: but this is not secretary clinton started when she became secretary clinton. >> it's the secret life of hillary clinton. i always used to wonder why she never talked about that at all on the campaign trail. that was secret thing when she was first lady she was doing this constantly. always meeting with women wherever she went and those women years later would say that was a seminal moment because they gave her validation in their countries, made him feel that they were heard, feel inspired to continue and it made them figures of prestige in their country. >> rose: how do you think america will be different if she had been elect president? >> in some ways it may turn out it was a good thing she didn't. in this role she has been able to do so much whereas if she had won the presidency it's possible she would not have been able to have such a cyring focus on changing the way we conduct foreign policy in the world. >> rose: perhaps so.
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what kind of president do you think she would be compare to what the president has done? >> i think she would have been a superb president and i still think there is time to be so although i don't think she will want to do it again. >> rose: why is that? i think she would and most people don't think so. >> i think... i just get a sense that her passion now is to work in this area with women actually and i suspect she will feel now that that... she wants to do something for herself and that that's what she wants to do. >> rose: but in 2016 she's still young enough to run and she will have been rested. >> she might change her mine. >> and that's the obvious choice for the democrats because they don't have a vice president who would... >> i think she could do that. but the process has become such a degrading process that you have to be up for it. you have to go want to go through that process again and even though everybody's loving her now in her current role and she's so popular and become an
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icon nick figure, once that process starts again it's back to mud wrestling and i don't know. she's tough and she's got the stamina. >> anybody can come to this? >> every seat is filled. >> rose: so too late if you wanted to come? >> you can watch it live stream on the daily beast. we're going to live stream every bit of it. it will be incredible. we will have meryl streep, angelina jolie, madeleine albright, we have hillary clinton. >> they're all speaking, participating? >> talking on panels and, of course, the people that i think the stories that you'll probably remember longer are going to be some of the women we've talked about. >> some amazing stories of fearless women. >> let me talk about violence against women because for people in the western world there's an element of that they don't know. they hear about it but the searing impact of what it does to the conscience of people is not known. >> i constantly read... one does
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constantly read about women who've taken out action against... restraining orders against husbands who are violent or lovers who are violent and time and time again they are nonetheless abused and murdered. happens constantly. women are very, very unprotected still and it's something people like to think is a solved issue but it isn't and it's something we have to spend a lot of time really thinking about how to protect womenle from the violence in their own homes very often. >> rose: while you have you here this is "newsweek" magazine, how is "newsweek" magazine doing? in a very tough environment. this is a tough neighborhood. >> well, we had a tough first year as we merged with the daily beast but we're on a role now. >> rose: how? >> because we're up, up, up in a climate that is down, down, down (. >> rose: has also that always been the ball game for newsmagazines? >> it's really the metrics that
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you use. to know what their health is because it's something you can't argue with. people paid money and they brought... the wonderful thing now is that we are up on the newsstand and that's been... after years and years of being down and in a climate that's down most magazines are down. so we're very excited. >> rose: so you had to spend a year making your magazine? we have spent a year fleeing around trying to get this merger done and it was tough to do because it was a magazine that was sort of in freefall so first we had to arrest the decline. that was the first year's project. just arrest the decline as it was hurdling down. >> rose: how will you define success in >> well, i think in feeling that the magazine is on a financial footing. >> rose: there that there's some influence among people? >> but we want to stabilize the magazine and make it a successful because because. we're 144% up in traffic this year. >> rose: where does the daily beast end and news week begin and news weekend and dahl t
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daily beast begin? >> well, the daily beast and news week is put out by the same staff. it's completely merged staff in a new building and. >> rose: you have a floor there? >> we have a cool floor with traffic numbers going up and down on t.v. screens and it's a very exciting merged newsroom. the beast has been so important because the talent on the beast in the sense of stories constantly pulsing through the beast is... has enabled us at news week to create a magazine in direct opposition in a sense to the 24/7 news culture. instead of it being... here we have a magazine how do we create a web site, here we have a successful web site, news site online. how do you create a magazine that plays against that 24/7 cycle so "newsweek" has
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developed a strong identity of being stories that are predictive or reconstructive. >> rose: not just a rehash of what happened during the week. >> and it's the same audience and a different mood. you can come in the morning and get your daily beast intensity but in the weekends you're in a different mood and then you want something more reflective. >> rose: this a happy time for tina? >> tina is really happy. we're really having a good time. i have my beast intense friday the daily beast, we have terrific thoughtful journalism in "newsweek". we're doing women in the world where we're bringing together fabulous passionate enterprising women. this is one of the happiest times i've been in. >> rose: really. >> loving every bit. >> rose: thank you for coming sglrx thank you, charlie. >> rose: tina brown, the summit starts tomorrow night. >> tomorrow night. >> rose: here in new york. captioning sponsored by rose communications
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